Thank you, thank you all, I'm making a list of all the advice- It
just SO HELPS that I don't feel like I'm the only one in the whole
world who sees how dangerous this is and I don't feel so crazy and
frantic anymore. She did call yesterday, we 'smoothed' things out
for now- she started going into how I can talk to the uplines if I
want now- but now I don't think I will, based on your advice. I
think it just antagonized them to rally the wagons around her. I
did try talking to the husband the day before, that went so-so... he
was defending his mother. We will make a safety plan, and i'll try
and see her this weekend or next week- she seems fine on the phone
now- I guess it's called the "honeymoon" period. When she called I
said we should just try to avoid talking about the business, and she
said 'but mom, I just want to share my successes with you'. Is that
normal Quixtar talk? Is that the emotional tugging or whatever?
What do I say to that? Every time I even think of her stupid
business my blood boils- yes, hard to keep my mouth shut and I know
I have to, so I'll give it my best shot. My husband doesn't see the
danger in the business- that they all rally around and try to
isolate her from us, esp when he hurt her. I just hate them. I
think I need to stay totally away from them because I can usually be
civil except when something like this happens. I have to run now
and I'll update more this weekend and I can't thank you enough for
the support.
--- In mlmsurvivorsclub@
>
> First, I'm very sorry you're in this situation. I got extremely
angry
> reading your letter. I used to teach in treatment centers and saw
so
> much of this that it makes me sick. You've already gotten
excellent
> advice from hit_margin and narcissedespres. Do keep that journal
and
> keep records of everything going on.
>
> It's hindsight now, but if (and I hope it's a when, not an if) you
get a
> call asking to come get her, do NOT call the scumbags at all.
Just go,
> pick her and the kid (and dog, if possible) up and secure her
safety.
> Then talk to CPS (Child Protective Services) about the situation
to get
> help with counseling. It's amazing that she's called you. In the
> environment she's in, most victims just keep taking the abuse and
> blaming themselves.
>
> Do NOT talk with her husband, his family, or their upline AT ALL.
If
> you have to talk with them in any social situations, be very
polite.
> These people are mentally and emotionally weak, which is why he
needs
> to beat up others. They do not have the strength to see anything
they
> do as wrong and have to believe they are always right. They think
they
> are good and your daughter has problems. I know that is
frustrating,
> but it is true and it's important to remember that. There is
nothing
> you can say or do that will help them see the truth. They don't
want
> to see it because that would force them to admit what monsters
they
> are.
>
> Any of us would be burning with rage in your position and it would
be
> hard to not tell them what bastards they are. That's why it's
> important to avoid them and not talk to them. All you can do is
the
> hardest job you'll ever do in your life: wait it out. Wait for
her to
> call. When she does and she needs help, be ready to leave and
pick her
> and the kid up immediately. She needs to get out of the house
where he
> can't control her. After a beating, many times the abuser sees
they've
> lost control and will switch to a super-nice mode and beg and
plead and
> promise they will never do it again. They may give their spouse
> flowers and act like they are sorry. This is part of the abuse
cycle.
>
> That's why, when she calls, you want to get her out of there. If
she
> has trouble calling and you do communicate, get her a cell phone
she
> can hide and use to call you. Pay the bill and keep it up to date
so
> she has that hidden and can get help from you without him knowing
it.
>
> In a part time job I've had for a number of years I deal with a
lot of
> women in abusive relationships. They're scared to leave and the
bully
> has taken away their self confidence. I tell them I know how they
> feel, but what I'll tell you that I don't tell them is that abuse
goes
> both ways and isn't always physical. I know what it's like to be
in a
> relationship with someone who can't see anything they do as wrong
and
> blames you for everything. I wasn't beaten or hit, but I was
> emotionally battered and it took me years after she left for me to
gain
> any self confidence. I should have asked her to leave (we lived
in
> property owned by my family), but I had gotten to the point I
didn't
> think I could live on my own.
>
> That is where your daughter is. She doesn't think she can make it
on
> her own and he wants it that way.
>
> One other important point I tell women in that situation: our
children
> learn what love is like by how Mommy and Daddy treat each other.
When
> it's appropriate, and ONLY when you feel it will sink in (and
> preferably when it will feel like a slap in the face to her),
point out
> that by staying with her husband, your daughter is teaching her
> daughter that in a loving relationship Daddy beats up Mommy. She
is
> teaching her daughter to find a man who beats her.
>
> Two more quick points on this: "Violence is the last refuge of the
> incompetent.
the
> first man to run out of ideas." (Nicholas Meyer in his
script "Time
> After Time.") This man is a coward and bully. If he had true
inner
> strength, he would not be doing this. That's also a reminder he
does
> not have the true strength to face what he's doing or to seek
> counseling because he'd have to face himself and his own
weaknesses.
>
> I'm not at all saying you taught that. She got sucked in
somehow. But
> make sure she gets the message that is what she's teaching her
> daughter. She may not get out for herself, but more women will
get out
> for their daughter than for themselves. Don't tell her that
(about
> what she's teaching her daughter) as an attempt to convince her.
That
> won't work. Drive it home when she is ready to hear it. It's a
tough
> point, but that is one thing that could keep her from going back.
>
> I hope she calls again and you can get her out of there. Find out
how
> to reach all the women's shelters around her area and be ready, if
she
> calls, to get someone from one of them to meet her or pick her up
ASAP.
> They'll probably want to talk to her first to be sure she wants to
get
> out, which is another good reason for her to have a secret cell
phone
> hubby doesn't know about.
>
> As we Quakers say, I will hold you in the Light.
>
> Hal
>
>
> On Wednesday 11 July 2007, gardeningkelly wrote:
> > Hi- I wrote last in May, that my daughter was being brainwashed
by
> > her husband's family. Thanks for the support and the
information I
> > received. I'm freightened to even write this, because I see I
could
> > have hidden my e-mail name, but I'm so frantic at this point I
don't
> > care. She has been married a little over a year and instantly
> > became involved with Quixtar through his family, who live in
Arden
> > Hills, MN. They are under Mr. Smith who is under Burt Gulick. I
> > have spent the past couple of months reading everything I can get
> > ahold of and gathering my information and trying to be very
careful
> > with what I say. In the meantime, her husband began physically
> > abusing her. Another instance, the husband and his sister
kidnapped
> > the baby (she was breastfeeding) and wouldn't tell her where the
> > baby was for over 3 hours. After his, she came home and refused
to
> > go back until he received anger management counselilng. He
> > supposedly was going, until we discovered that he had lied about
> > it. The got "marriage counseling" from their "upline". (Can you
> > tell how frantic I am?) There have been 3 major instances of
> > physical abuse, the last one was last weekend in Missouri at the
> > Quixtar Family Reunion in (Osage Beach?) Missouri. They got
into a
> > physical altercation and our daughter called us and asked us to
come
> > and get her as she said she as afraid he was going to kill her.
We
> > called his parents, and his mother, a long-time Amway sales
> > prostitute from hell, proceeded to tell us why his violence was
all
> > my daughter's fault for starting the argument in the first place,
> > and they would be counseled by Mr. Smith. We got into a shouting
> > match on the phone, and I insisted this time that if they thought
> > they were going to have their upline "counsel" them again and
> > anything happened to my duaghter, I was going to sue them, Mr.
> > Smith, Mr. Gulick, all the way up to that motherfucker Yager,
excuse
> > my language, with every cent and breath I had until my dying day.
> > Well, suddenly my duaghter's visit was canceled, the son came to
> > pick up the dog and wouldn't let me see my grandchild, and I got
a
> > phone message from my daughter that I could never see my
grandchild
> > again or her future children because I "teach bad (negative)
things"
> > and "yes, mom, family members who aren't in Quixtar get pushed
away
> > by us because we grow and you don't". My husband is trying to
keep
> > the lines of communication open to her. I fear for her life and
her
> > safety and my grandchild's safety. I'm so damned sick of hearing
> > those Amway quips "Quitters never win!" "Leaders are
> > readers!" "Stay positive!". I'm still reading the online book,
I'm
> > halfway through the Smoke and Mirrors book. I'm despirate, I
feel
> > like I'm a caged animal, I feel like I'm at the edge of a lake
> > watching my child drown and someone is holding me back from
swimming
> > out to save her. I can't sleep, I can't eat, and I'm feeling
like
> > this is a nightmare I'll never wake up from. Help.
>
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