On Sunday 25 March 2007 23:31, Francie Smart wrote:
> I think it's really important to stay with what I might call facts,
> although that's not exactly the word I'm looking for.
Oh, boy, do I smell an MLM truth twisting session coming after that.
Yep. Without reading another sentence, that tells me someone is about
to start taking words and using them to mean what they want instead of
what they mean.
A statement is a fact or an opinion or a theory or hypothesis or
metaphor or fiction. Even some of those aren't distinct and come under
other categories.
Facts are facts. That's it. That's the long and short of it. If you
want to make statements that are facts, make them. If they're not
facts, then let us know if they're lies, theories, or something else.
Don't confuse the terms. As E.B. White said in "Elements of
Style," "Use the right word, not it's cousin." If you don't know the
right word, discover a thesaurus. I'm being super picky here because,
in this case, the wording is important.
> Somehow trying
> to bundle the statement "these claims have not been endorsed ( and
> by the way its "evaluated") by the FDA" into MLM is just silly.
> Every supplement you buy, or any foods that claim a health benefit
> (Grape juice comes to mind), whether MLM or anywhere says the same
> thing. When we allow the bitterness toward MLM to cloud things other
> than MLM, the waters get muddied.
That is a fair point, isolated by itself. Yes, there are many products
that make those claims. Yet, your statement has nothing to do with the
situation. It is a non sequitur, having nothing to do with the point
made.
Why?
Simple. Nobody sells grape juice saying it helps cure cancer. There
are discussions about what root or herb takes car of various ills and
ailments, but even in any health food store you don't hear the
extraordinary claims about something curing cancer.
> As for Noni Juice, whether MLM or not, and I prefer the NOT, it has
> very powerful nutrient properties.
And this has been proven in double blind studies and actual scientific
experiments and studies that have been peer reviewed and firmly
established, right? Or is the evidence anecdotal and compiled by
people working for companies selling it and who benefit if their claims
are taken seriously?
> It certainly is not THE end all
> and be all to fighting something like cancer, I would agree.
My Father (and best friend) just died from leukemia, which is a form of
cancer. If you want to continue down this road and start going down
this road and make any kind of claims about how it fights cancer, go
ahead, but I'm warning you, I will forget I'm a pacifist and a member
of a peace church and I will verbally tear you to pieces. Why?
Because the only way such a statement could be made is out of extreme
ignorance.
We were lucky. When Dad was diagnosed, about 3 years ago, one doctor
basically said, "You need to call the hospice program and talk with
them." For those that don't know, at least locally, hospice is
specifically for the last six months of one's life. The other doctor
that he saw started researching. He knows what to look for. He kept
my Father alive and gave him three more years, most of that quality
time. I watched what was going on and talked with the doctor and so
did other family members. There's no conspiracy to keep drugs off the
market. There's no magic silver bullet that will knock out cancer. I
wish to high heaven there were, since if there were, my Father would
still be alive, but there isn't.
Such myths stay alive because we want to believe that there is some
juice or powder or potion from one of the lost jungles of the world
that will cure all cancer. Hell, it's not just cancer. We want a
panacea, so it's easy to believe it when someone says there is a cure.
The truth is there isn't. If Noni juice or some other witch's brew (my
apologies to Wiccans, but I think the term comes across with my intent)
could cure cancer, Dad's doctor would have used it in a heart beat. If
it would have even retarded the cancer and given him another week to
live, he would have done the same.
The point is that doctors have years and years of training that most of
us never have. They aren't trying to hide cures. They are trying to
find them and make people well. If there were a magic bullet, they'd
be using it. Any pharma company that could claim such a magic bullet
would see surges in profit and stock prices that have never been seen
in history before. They could blow away all the other companies and
their drug cocktails. If a researcher at a company had found ways to
cure cancer and it was being suppressed, they would have every
motivation to leak the information. It would make their reputation and
they would go down in history for saving millions of lives.
Noni Juice even helping in curing cancer? Don't even think of going
there.
Unless you're stupid.
> The
> most highly visible form of Noni Juice is from MLM companies, but it
> can be purchased at more reasonable prices at many health food stores
> too. Its a juice for cry'n out loud... a food. Would you say the
> same about grape juice?
Okay, it's late, I want to go to bed, so I'm going to simplify this and
say it's a red herring. You're implying that how people treat grape
juice actually has an effect on the Noni juice situation. It doesn't.
> It's being touted as having anti-oxidant,
> free radical scavenging abilities. That "statement", "not been
> evaluated by the FDA" is also on bottles of grape juice that make
> statements about its anti-oxident qualities.
And, again, it doesn't matter.
Just what are you trying to say? That Noni Juice is useful after all?
Hal
> Francie
>
> Vicki <v_eller@yahoo.
> Glad to hear they got out of Quixtar
>
> As for the Noni Juice. It's over-priced, tastes disgusting and does
> NOT solve any of your ills. So don't let your friend believe it. I
> am sure there is a disclaimer somewhere that says something
> like "these claims have not been endorsed by the FDA".
>
> ALL MLM's are the same. And I can also buy Fuller Brush in my local
> VF Outlet store... but it is STILL over-priced.
>
> --- In mlmsurvivorsclub@
>
> <frances_lyman@
> > I am a former member of this group who has returned!!!! I
>
> remember some of you but I am sure you don't remember me, as there
> are so many people out there who have been affected by MLM's. My
> son and daughter in law were introduced to Quixtar. The amount they
> lost, is nothing compared to most in this group, but that is because
> they didn't have much to loose!!! It was so very sad to watch them
> work so hard and go through all they did, and not even know what was
> happening. You all in this group, helped me to understand that
> there was nothing I could really do, except stick by them and love
> them regardless. I was trying really hard to do that, but it got to
> a point where there was absolutely no food in the house, and they
> had three small children. My daughter in law had to go see if she
> could get help from the state and they qualified, but no money for a
> couple of days. She asked the lady that helped her with the
> paperwork, what she was supposed to do, for food, until
>
> > then. The lady sent her to the food bank, where they loaded up
>
> her car. That is what they had to eat for a couple of weeks!!! All
> during this time, the Quixtar people were telling them that they
> shouldn't quit. They needed to keep going. They ended up quitting,
> because they had no more to give. They have not heard from
> their "friends" since.
>
> > They seem to be doing alright now. There is no desire to return
>
> to "the business" but they don't seem to want to totally give up
> their concept of the type of person Lennon Ledbetter is. They still
> think he is a pretty cool guy, but all of the time, they seem to
> give up a little more. I think a lot of the reason that they hang
> on to a little of the whole thing, is because they are still
> embarassed.
>
> > I will admit that I left the group, as there was so much
>
> sadness, and devastation, that it was hard to deal with. The
> devastation that I saw happening to my children, was pale in
> comparison to so many other, and it was depressing.
>
> > The reason for my return to the group, was that my brother in
>
> law who has just been diagnosed with colon cancer and is getting
> chemo treatments, heard about "Noni Juice" from one of his co-
> workers. We happen to live in the town where the corporate
> headquarters is. I called the company to see if they carried what
> he was looking for. The company is called Tahitian Noni. I also
> looked up some info online, and some of the things I read just set
> off alarms. It talked about uplines and stuff like that. Since, I
> have found out that Tahitian Noni, and Noni Juice is an MLM. Do you
> all know anything about it????
>
> > I guess after all of this time, I had forgotten just how sneaky
>
> and manipulating these MLM's are. I was totally amazed that this
> company was an MLM. I just thought it was some kinc of power drink
> or something. It was scary how something like that could be in this
> town and no one really knows. Like I said, since then, I have found
> out that some people do know, but it is a very well kept secret.
>
> > In addition to Tahitian Noni, I wanted to ask you all what you
>
> think about Fuller Brush and Watkins. My brother in law has been
> with Fuller Brush for years, and Watkins a couple of times in the
> past. I had purchase a couple of things from him, until I found out
> they were affiliated with Quixtar. Do you know the degree of
> involvment??
> if there is one, or are they bad ones????
>
> > It is hard to trust anymore.
> >
> > Frances L.
> >
> >
> > Frances
> >
> > "Goals are stars to steer by, not sticks to beat yourself up
>
> with".
>
> > ~Barbara B. Smith
> >
> >
> > ------------
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