Saturday, June 30, 2007

[MLM Survivors Club] Re: the team mlm. REQUEST FOR HELP

Here is some disturbing info I took out the the TEAM manual, if it
helps:

I got a hold of the Quixtar TEAM manual while I was staying at my
sister's house last week and read through it...some disturbing things
that I read. I don't see how they can say they are not primarily
making money from tools with the way this manual is worded! These are
direct quotes unless noted otherwise:

In regards to recruiting:

-- It is best to answer questions with another question. This is
easier if you have a few responses memorized ahead of time.

--If asked about the legality of the business just hand them a cd with
the answer

--Showing the plan is not intended to "sign them up" but primarily to
get them involved in the teaching. It is much more important to have
someone reading books and attending meetings and NOT signed up than to
have them signed up and not involved in the system.

--Signing up a new IBO is a bridle and saddle activity. It is surely
important but only after the horse is nourished . (meaning after they
are in the "system" and being nourished with tools)

--The system, not the business owner, run the business. (ummm...I
thought a business owner ran his or her business?)

--Promote tools like the seeds of a future harvest. (harvest for
Diamonds)

And then what you need to do to become a "Power Player"

1. Sign up for Cd of the Month
2. Sign up for Book of the Month
3. Sign up for a standing order leadership cd
4. Purchase Top 50 cd set
5. Attend open meetings and night owls
6. Attend mens/ladies leadership meetings
7. Attend seminars
8. Attend major functions
9. Subscribe to website
10. Subscribe to voicemail

Ummmm...how about selling product????

Then, for those of you who are not (lol) enlightened, their new thing
is to have everyone sign up for DOT1/STEP, which means Ditto on the
1st
and Sip Twice, Eat and Profit. Ditto is their standing motnhly order
they want you to sign up for so you get the same bundle of crap each
month, and the Sip Twice refers to their XS energy drinks, which I
believe you are REQUIRED to take two cases of which each monthly
order,
and EAT refers to the power/meal replacement bars. So basically you
have to buy the drinks and stuff along with whatever else you have
each
month. The PROFIT part...not sure where that comes in for the person
buying all this stuff!

Lastly, this is the lovely disclaimer at the end of the book:

"While the techniques and approaches suggested have worked for others,
no one can guarantee that these techniques and approaches will work
for
you. We hope, however, that these ideas assist you in developing a
strong and profitable business."

I thought this was a "proven" system?!?

I hope it is ok to post this here...someone had asked about TEAM
recently, and I just thought that this information spoke volumes about
where the real money is made in Quixtar.

This info was all taken from The TEAM Builder's Textbook: Building
Communication in the Info Age by Woodward/Brady

--- In mlmsurvivorsclub@yahoogroups.com, "bergenstroll"
<bergenstroll@...> wrote:
>
> I AM MEETING THIS EVENING WITH MY 24 YEAR OLD SON AND WANT TO BRING
TO
> HIS ATTENTION THE REAL FACTS ABOUT THIS GROUP AND MLM'S IN GENERAL.
I
> DO NOT WANT TO BE CONFRONTATIONAL.CAN ANYONE OFFER SUGGESTIONS HOW
TO
> HANDLE THIS WITHOUT ALIENATING MY SON. HE IS VERY BRIGHT AND VERY
SOLD
> ON THE TEAM. THANKS.
>

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[MLM Survivors Club] Re: "eat once, drink twice"

Quixtar's TEAM uses the STEP program...sip twice, eat and profit. Not
sure if that is the one you are talking about or not, I am sure other
groups uses similar techniques, but this is what it means in Quixtar:

They require you to sign up for DOT1/STEP, which means Ditto on the 1st
and Sip Twice, Eat and Profit. Ditto is their standing monthly order
they want you to sign up for so you get the same bundle of crap each
month, and the Sip Twice refers to their XS energy drinks, which I
believe you are REQUIRED to take two cases of which each monthly order,
and EAT refers to the power/meal replacement bars. So basically you
have to buy the drinks and stuff along with whatever else you have each
month. The PROFIT part...not sure where that comes in for the person
buying all this stuff!

Hope that helps!

Jen

--- In mlmsurvivorsclub@yahoogroups.com, "captncrunch_99"
<captncrunch1999@...> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> I had a friend send me some promo crap about a pyramyd - can't
> remember the name. He is from the Detroit area...and the deal is
that
> you buy the food (energy drinks+bars)...but you're really selling to
> other "distributers." All I remember is the "tag line" that they
want
> their "members" to "eat once, drink twice" (per day). It's clearly a
> MLM scheme...does anyone know the name (I don't remember) - I'd like
> to do some research and send him links so he can (maybe) get out of
> this scheme. Thanks in advance...
>
> Cap
>

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[MLM Survivors Club] To Frank again

Frank: You don't have to market your Consumer Protection Consultancy here. It's now time for you to read the rules of this forum. Like you previously said, now you're the scammer who pitch in as sympathetic and trying to help people thru' consumer advice. Try your luck somewhere dude!

Regarding the Video you mentioned, it's just a Google/youtube Video plugin for Blogspot where the videos will be displayed based on Google search words. I put the search word as "Amway Scam" and the videos in that category will be displayed(search videos with the above mentioned keywords and you'll see that so called video in that list). I have no control over what videos are displayed and she might have put her video keyword as Amway scam too. If you've basic knowledge of blogging (i can see that you're hosting a blog in blogspot), try exploring google video plugin in blogspot before making childish observations.

I wonder why you only saw that lady's video only and NOT Eric Scheibeler's video in that list.

My advice to you is
1. Avoid cheap marketing tactics of your consultancy by disrespecting members.
2. Get a good knowledge of stuffs on which you comment. For that atleast read and gain knowldge rather than reading bits and pieces.
3. If you are running your consultancy with this attitude of partial knowledge, I feel sorry about your clients (if you've any)

Good luck!
Ann
Frank Thomas <franktho1@yahoo.com> wrote: Hi Robby:
I went back to site Ann left on her message.

It had a "Quixtar real story video".
I listened to the whole thing with heart felt sympathy for the ladies story
about losing big bucks in Amway and Herbalife. She labeled herself a MLM junkie.
Then she pitches a lead generation program with typical hype.

This was an australian lady. If it wasn't Ann then I do apologize for painting her with to broad of a brush.

I try to respect the illness that junkies must fight. But for the grace of God there go I.

Occassionally I over react when someone pitches an internet biz or mlm.This forum is
an oasis for us all. A safe place to discuss and help.

To Ann- Please forgive me if that was not you and if it was still forgive me and let us
try to find some healthy alternatives to earn an honest and ethical living.

Your servant
Frank Thomas
ask the consumer advocate
Consumeradvokate.com

Frank Thomas
johnleland.blogspot.com

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Friday, June 29, 2007

[MLM Survivors Club] Re:Agloco?

Hi Robby:
I went back to site Ann left on her message.

It had a "Quixtar real story video".
I listened to the whole thing with heart felt sympathy for the ladies story
about losing big bucks in Amway and Herbalife. She labeled herself a MLM junkie.
Then she pitches a lead generation program with typical hype.

This was an australian lady. If it wasn't Ann then I do apologize for painting her with to broad of a brush.

I try to respect the illness that junkies must fight. But for the grace of God there go I.

Occassionally I over react when someone pitches an internet biz or mlm.This forum is
an oasis for us all. A safe place to discuss and help.

To Ann- Please forgive me if that was not you and if it was still forgive me and let us
try to find some healthy alternatives to earn an honest and ethical living.

Your servant
Frank Thomas
ask the consumer advocate
Consumeradvokate.com

Frank Thomas
johnleland.blogspot.com

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Re: [MLM Survivors Club] Re:Agloco?

Frank: Don't pretend and show off as too intelligent. Have ever read my blog? I hope you may not. You might have had a glance of it and threw your "expert comment". It's not shame on me, but shame on you. How come you call me a scammer? I myself is a victim of Quixtar/BWW and my blog is just that and NOT about any scams which I haven't went thru'?

By your wierd posting about me, What do you expect? I need to come and take your legal advice or market for others to get your advice thru' consumeradvokate.com? If you want to market your legal expertise, try some other tactics rather than throwing at somebody's post and calling others a scammer! Don't pretend too much? Read my blog, if you understand!

~Ann

Frank Thomas <franktho1@yahoo.com> wrote: Ann - Please read the rules. Recruiting is not allowed on this forum. Your
url is an anti-scam scam site.

Anti-scam scammers are the worst. They pretend to sympatize with MLM
survivors then pitch their own scam
Shame on you.

Frank Thomas
consumeradvokate.com



Frank Thomas
johnleland.blogspot.com

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Thursday, June 28, 2007

[MLM Survivors Club] Re: the team mlm. REQUEST FOR HELP

--- In mlmsurvivorsclub@yahoogroups.com, "bergenstroll"
<bergenstroll@...> wrote:
>
> I AM MEETING THIS EVENING WITH MY 24 YEAR OLD SON AND WANT TO BRING TO
> HIS ATTENTION THE REAL FACTS ABOUT THIS GROUP AND MLM'S IN GENERAL. I
> DO NOT WANT TO BE CONFRONTATIONAL.CAN ANYONE OFFER SUGGESTIONS HOW TO
> HANDLE THIS WITHOUT ALIENATING MY SON. HE IS VERY BRIGHT AND VERY SOLD
> ON THE TEAM. THANKS.
>

Assuming you've been reading posts from the past - you should be able
to recognize the tactics they use to draw people in?? Take notes -
then discuss what you saw and heard later with your son. Point out
that most real businesses pay attention to cold hard accounting facts;
but the Motivational Gurus want the IBOs to "follow their dreams".
Why?? because there's no line for "dreams" on a Balance Sheet....LOL!!

Another common thing is the way they throw around the 100PV per person
number.... yet Amway/Quixtar's own numbers show that the average IBO
does 38 PV per month. That same report, called the Platinum Index,
shows that 66% of all new IBOs who are signed up will NOT renew the
following year. Common sense tells you that this is going to be a
difficult business to build and maintain....

Many people (probably including your bright son) are drawn to the
uplifting and excited atmosphere that surrounds these groups like
TEAM. It's completely artificial. I have seen the "rules" regarding
how a Diamond is supposed to be treated - the edification is forced.
If your son misses a function or decides to forego a few tapes - the
"love" will disappear...until he sees the "error of his ways". It IS
very cultlike.

He'll also be told TEAM is "different" from the others. I have been
on this forum for close to 10 years - and the stories I have read
from hundreds of people involved with many different Motivational
Groups are all frighteningly similar. Although I don't have firsthand
experience with TEAM, the stuff I have read indicates they rank pretty
high on the "Lie Quotient" - many other groups at least admit their
close affiliation with the Amway/Quixtar Corporation.

Deb

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Re: [MLM Survivors Club] the team mlm. REQUEST FOR HELP

Hello

In general, don't tell your son anything. Ask him lots of things.

How does he know that his upline are making money? Has he seen hard evidence, ie tax returns, not just fake-it-till-you-make-it appearances of money?

Has he been uncomfortable about anything he's been asked to do so far in the business, ie. contacting people using the 'curiosity approach' rather than being straightforward with people about what the business is.

Do you know what your son hopes to gain from his involvement in the business? Do his upline ever use this goal against him - as in "the other night you told me that you wanted to find a way to spend more time with your family, were you serious about that?" This is a way they guilt-trip people into staying in the business because no one wants to say that they don't, after all, want more time with their family (or whatever really important hot button goal they've identified).

I think it's in the novel Dune by Frank Herbert, someone says "what you most love will be used against you."

Do bear that in mind when talking to your son. The TEAM people have convinced him that they are the only way he'll achieve his dream goal.

Good luck.

Helen

bergenstroll <bergenstroll@yahoo.com> wrote: I AM MEETING THIS EVENING WITH MY 24 YEAR OLD SON AND WANT TO BRING TO
HIS ATTENTION THE REAL FACTS ABOUT THIS GROUP AND MLM'S IN GENERAL. I
DO NOT WANT TO BE CONFRONTATIONAL.CAN ANYONE OFFER SUGGESTIONS HOW TO
HANDLE THIS WITHOUT ALIENATING MY SON. HE IS VERY BRIGHT AND VERY SOLD
ON THE TEAM. THANKS.





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Re: [MLM Survivors Club] the team mlm. REQUEST FOR HELP

On 6/28/07 6:29 AM, "bergenstroll" <bergenstroll@yahoo.com> wrote:

> I am meeting this evening with my 24 year old son and want to bring to his
> attention the real facts about this group and mlm's in general. I do not want
> to be confrontational. Can anyone offer suggestions how to handle this without
> alienating my son. he is very bright and very sold on the team. thanks.

As PW and others that have successfully talked with family members about
their relationship with a particular MLM, not being confrontational is the
key to maintaining a dialogue. Also, don't be judgemental and be aware that
their MLM has trained them not to listen to anything "negative" about their
participation. One thing you can certainly do is keep asking them to explain
the details to you. Ask them how the money works, and how much time is
really involved. Also ask them what they actually do during that time. Ask
them about how the seminars, rallies, cd's and books are distributed and who
gets paid and when. There is a derth of information in the archives of this
list that you should review before meeting up with your son.

--
Regards,
John

"Faced with the choice between changing one's mind
and proving that there is no need to do so,
almost everyone gets busy on the proof." - Galbraith

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[MLM Survivors Club] the team mlm. REQUEST FOR HELP

I AM MEETING THIS EVENING WITH MY 24 YEAR OLD SON AND WANT TO BRING TO
HIS ATTENTION THE REAL FACTS ABOUT THIS GROUP AND MLM'S IN GENERAL. I
DO NOT WANT TO BE CONFRONTATIONAL.CAN ANYONE OFFER SUGGESTIONS HOW TO
HANDLE THIS WITHOUT ALIENATING MY SON. HE IS VERY BRIGHT AND VERY SOLD
ON THE TEAM. THANKS.

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Wednesday, June 27, 2007

[MLM Survivors Club] Re:Agloco?

Frank,

In defense of Ann, I also thought the link to her site was an mlm
plug but when I visited it I found that it was very critical of the
the amway/quixtar amo business. Granted I did not read all the
postings but the ones I did highlighted the abuses we are all so
familiar with. If it's an anti-scam scam site then it is either too
subtle for me to detect or I am getting lazy in my old age.

Robby

--- In mlmsurvivorsclub@yahoogroups.com, Frank Thomas
<franktho1@...> wrote:
>
> Ann - Please read the rules. Recruiting is not allowed on this
forum. Your
> url is an anti-scam scam site.
>
> Anti-scam scammers are the worst. They pretend to sympatize
with MLM
> survivors then pitch their own scam
> Shame on you.
>
> Frank Thomas
> consumeradvokate.com
>
>
>
>
> Frank Thomas
> johnleland.blogspot.com
>
> ---------------------------------
> Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Yahoo!
Travel.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

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