--- In mlmsurvivorsclub@
<Narcissedespres@
>
> An update:)....
>
> My boyfriend's upline did come for a visit. I didn't get a chance
to
> speak with him personally, however, my boyfriend did ask him about
the
> tool/function money, and when IBOs started to see that money.
>
> To my surprise, the question was answered pretty well. He was told
> that once you hit Platinum, you begin to see some of the profit
from
> the tools and they may start to pay you for training people
(running
> weekly meetings), and more once you hit Emerald and above. Most of
> the money you see is from tools, but you get some amount of
function
> money depending on how many IBOs in your leg? section? go to the
> functions. The upline also explained that Diamonds have a food
spread
> and such at the functions that everyone else does not, so some of
the
> function money goes toward that, although you don't see those
benefits
> until you reach diamond. The higher you get, the more money you
make,
> though the upline wasn't sure of the exact amounts. Even more to my
> surprise, he told my boyfriend all questions along this line were
> welcome, and that he'd (upline) asked similar ones when he started.
> His upline also said that the money he tells people he makes (6
> figures) comes *only* from the Quixtar portion of the business, and
> the tool money is a separate figure that he does not add in.
>
> So...thoughts? I'm not really sure what to make of it all. Is it
the
> truth? Is it what the upline *believes* is true? I'm really not
sure
> what to make of it all.
Your boyfriend's upline has no choice but to fess up on the tool
money or be proven to be either a liar or repeating a lie he
believes to be true. In the pre-Internet days the response would
have been, as it was for me and many of us in this club, "the tool
money covers only the cost of producing the tapes and any function
money just covers the cost of that function and what little money
left leftover covers those functions that lose money."
The Internet has through these anti-mlm sites played a pivotal role
in exposing this LIE via court filings, tax cases, depositions,
scanned documents, company memos, and personal experiences to name a
few. These are for the most part indisputable and overwhelming
evidence. Even with all this we still have some pros come in here
and try and tell us otherwise.
The fact is that this genie is out of the bottle and can't be put
back in. Therefore over the past few years we have seen tool money
grudgingly acknowledged. However the upline is still ignoring the
fact that the vast majority of the income the diamonds receive is
from the tool money, not retail sales/bonuses.
As far as what your upline describes it tracks pretty closely with
the tool money distribution information I have seen. Jeff P., a
disillusioned former amway emerald documents the tool payout as he
witnesed it on his now defunct but mirrored site, "An Emerald Tells
The Truth". I have included a link to his mirror site in case you
haven't seen it. http://www.amquix.
As far his claim that he makes 6 figures on the non-tool related
business - demand to see his IRS Schedule C which shows exactly
where his money came from and how much that is. If he refuses to do
that (will most likely be the case) you and your boyfriend can
determine a ballpark figure of his non-business income by figuring
out how many legs and and how many directs (platinums) are under
him. Granted it won't be exact but it will give you some general
idea. If he is claiming 6 figures and he is not a diamond then he
is lying. Here is what former diamond Don Lorencz has to say about
it:
http://web.archive.
com/
>
> The rest of this post is quite long, but I have no other place to
> share all this. The first portion of this post, about the upline,
is
> what I thought most people would be interested in. Feel free to
read
> or skip the rest, but it's there in case anyone has any thoughts,
or
> has spare time to read my ramblings:)
>
> My boyfriend and I also had an interesting discussion re. the "cult
> side" of Quixtar, which *he* initiated. He said he feels that a
lot
> of the cult claims come from people who "ask their upline about
> everything". He says he's noticed this piece of advice on some of
his
> CDs (though it often seems to be in passing). One time it was
even in
> relation to dating. My BF stated that he would *never* ask his
upline
> what to do in a non-business situation (i.e. dating, marriage,
kids,
> buying a house or car) and he's not sure why some of the CDs say
to,
> or why some people do so.
This will be a bone of contention as the ibo's are required
to "counsel" upline on any decision if they expect to receive
support from the upline. This counsel covers any and everything,
most importantly personal, non-busines related matters. I only
counseled upline one time with my emerald and this was what I was
told. Quit visits with my father and family members who would not
join me in "building my business" as they were keeping me from
success. Ditto my best friend and and othere friends. Do not buy a
house or a car until my emerald gave me the green light. Cash in my
401K and invest that money in my business (read buy tools). Listen
to rush limbaugh on the radio. Vote Republican. Join a
fundamentalist Christian church.
Is amway/quixtar a cult - You Betcha!
He said his upline is aware that I'm not
> interested in Quixtar (ever), and that he's not sure what some of
the
> members of his upline would say if my BF directly asked them what
they
> thought of this. And then my BF stated that he would never find
out
> what they thought because he would never ask them. "It's none of
> their business. If you need to ask opinions about a relationship,
> you'd ask close friends and family, and then make your own decision
> regardless." And I told him I wouldn't be dating him in the first
> place if I thought he was the kind of person who would blindly ask
for
> and take advice that didn't make sense (i.e. "ask your upline").
>
>
> I'm hoping the fact that he's noticed these things in the CDs (and
> that these things bother him) might help out down the road.
>
> After that, he mentioned that the fact I'm not interested would be
> interesting "down the road" because all of the Diamonds on the CDs
are
> married and work together with their spouse. He's never heard of a
> person who is married and building the business alone. (Not that
were
> married, of course, but perhaps down the road...) He said that
often,
> one spouse was against the business and then later became
interested.
> I took this as an opening to stress again that even if the
businesses
> works exactly as he'd like it to, I still will never be
interested.
> Moral issues aside, selling anything at all (products or an
> idea)...it's not where my talents or interests lie and that most
> couples have separate professions and don't work together. Am I
> worried that this will all become some bigger issue down the road?
> Yes, though I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it won't...or that
> he'll get out of Quixtar before it does.
>
> -EA
>
Now for some really GOOD NEWS! From reading your posts and your
description of yourself and your boyfriend I predict that this will
soon be moot. It appears that you and your boyfriend are much too
independent minded to last long with this sham of a business. The
failure rate is 99.99+% and I expect that after a little time of
experiencing the lies first hand and their audacious behavior that
your boyfriend will drop them like a hot potato. amway/quixtar will
become just one of those, "what the Hell was I thinking"
embarrassments.
Good Luck,
Robby
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