Hal Vaughan, THANK YOU! THANK YOU! THANK YOU!!!
I have lots of questions but let me start with........
HV wrote:
"The people at the top don't make money on product sales, but on the
business tools."
Who makes all the money off the products?
HV wrote:
"There's also the functions they expect people to attend."
I'm chaperoning my wife to one this October. I think it's in
Kentucky. I'll fill you in on the experience. lol [;)] (as a note:
I support my Wife, but I do have boundaries. "Lovingly" let her
know I would not be attending all/most the functions.)
HV wrote:
"Make sure she keeps track of the money she spends."
THANKS for the reminder. I'm going to take a closer look at the
TRUE cost/purchases she has made. I was helping her create and keep
track of her expenses. No need to keep track of revenue when it's
ZERO. lol [:))]
Hal you got me thinking…… I really don't know how much she has
spent. [:-/]
Hal, thanks for helping think his through. [:D]
--- In mlmsurvivorsclub@
>
> On Thursday 30 August 2007, Loving Father wrote:
> First background:
> - My wife signed as a Team member a few months ago. (My personal
> opinion then and now – not a money making venture )
>
> - I am a partner in a "traditional" business that does quite well.
>
> - I support my wife just as she has supported me in …..ahhhhhhhh
> activates SHE shook her head at.
Support is fine, but don't go too far. Keep the income from your
business and use it for living expenses and make sure she keeps track
of what she spends.
Also, as a business owner, I'm sure you know the phrase you'll hear
often from Team members, "You've got to spend money to make money."
You'll hear that a lot. As you and I, as business owners, know, it
does take spending some money, but what do you spend it on? I'm in the
tech field. I had to buy computers and tech books. If I had not had
sales experience, I may have needed to get a few books on sales, but
that's about it. How much do you spend on "lessons" for how to do
something? Isn't there an end at some point where you stop paying for
lessons if there is no income? Or does a person just keep buying more
and more lessons? While the phrase about spending money is used often,
point out how much is spent and that there's a point where you have to
look at things logically. Isn't insanity doing the same thing over and
over and continuing to expect different results? Remember that if she
stays in for a few years and is still buying the tools.
> - as a business owner I have invested(paid) money and time for
> education on business development. (My college education which I paid
> BIG bucks and worked very hard studying to get a certificate of
> completion[degree]
>
> - I have lost money in different investments not because they were
> scams but because I was not educated enough to deal with the issues
> that arose.
>
> - SO FAR the cost of the "business training / personal growth
> material" by Team is much cheaper that what I have paid over the
> years.(I have taken Dale Carnegie, Zig Ziglar…etc,etc…
Personally, I don't think much of any of these. I think you can get as
much from books and spend less. There's nothing they can give you in
person that a good writer can't tell you in a book.
I also, honestly, don't think much of most self help books. In my
experience, they make their point in the first 50 pages, then spend the
next several hundred pages pounding it in.
> - The monthly products Team likes you to buy, small cans of pop
> called "energy drink" and candy bars called "energy bars" are
> way overpriced,. However my wife and I have a "splurge fund"
> and these over priced products don't even put a dent in our "splurge
fund"
I've told this story before about the energy bars. My ex-gf kept
pushing the bars and energy drinks they got through the system. She
gave me one to try. I put it in the fridge. There was one night I
needed a break from programming work and was exhausted. I grabbed that
energy drink and sat down to watch a 1 hr. documentary on Groom Lake
from the History Channel. I was really looking forward to that. I
drank the drink and was asleep in under half an hour.
Can anyone out there say "placebo?"
>
>
> -on a personal note:
>
> * SO FAR I feel the cost of the experience is well worth the
> education my wife is getting. (especially since the fall out.)
Much of that can come from a few self help books in the appropriate
topics anyway.
> *because of the resent law suits and the information being shared
> by the top-ranking people there are many inconsistencies with what
> both the Team and Amway preached before the law Suit and what they
> are preaching now.
There are many inconsistencies anyway, but people have been trained not
to notice them. The people at the top don't make money on product
sales, but on the business tools. That's a big part of the reason for
the lawsuit. Watch what people say now, with comments like how the
prices are too high for people to make a profit and see how they
compare with what they've said all along.
Look for sources of info from the outside and find what the leaders are
saying. It's not what they tell their downline.
>
>
> Question:
>
> I am very leery and I would like to know how do people loose Large
> amounts of money?
They don't lose it all at once. You know the story about the frog in
the pot on the stove? You start with it at room temp, then gradually
increase the heat and the frog supposedly is unable to detect small
increases in temperature and eventually will die in boiling water
before jumping out.
That's what goes on with this. People get in and piece by piece their
thinking changes. The CDs have people saying to buy all the CDs.
After a while, that message sinks in. It is, literally, a form of
brainwashing.
There's also the functions they expect people to attend. If you
ask, "Do I need to go?" They'll say, "Do you want to succeed?" They
start pushing more and more for people to buy more and more tools and
go to more functions. I broke down function expenses once. They were
charging $100 per person for one they expected up to 8,000 people. I
checked on the coliseum size and it was comparable to the one in my
town, so I called and checked on prices.
About $25,000 for one weekend rental. Someone else here indicated it
was also about $5,000 for the insurance. The advertising is free,
since it's through the network that the IBDrones pay for and they don't
have to pay people to work it, since people are eager to volunteer to
do it. What nobody bothered to do as add things up. About $30,000 in
costs and at $100 per person, if 6,000 people come in, that's an income
of $600,000. Take out the $30,000 and even allow another $15,000 for
various expenses (which should not be that high) and the income is
STILL over $550,000. Quite a tidy sum for a function where nobody
makes any profit, as they claim.
The documented odds of succeeding in any MLM are less than winning big
at Vegas.
Many people would do much better learning web design and charging
$75-$150 an hour to create websites. I know some people doing quite
well with that.
>
> (allowing my wife to buy some over priced products and "business
> training/personal growth material" she believes in is apart of
> marriage. Keeping ones partner from loosing Large amounts of money
> is also apart of marriage.)
Make sure she keeps track of the money she spends. They pretty much
discourage accounting because that would show people how much they're
losing.
Hal
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